DSI Prophet 12

Fri Jan 25 08:34:37 CET 2013

Thank you for the well reasoned & detailed explanation. I was not aware that the components & labor were that expensive. Sounds like a fair price for what you get, and separates the "wanna gets" like me from the "gonna gets". I'd have to settle for a DSP facsimile if I want VA/Analog sounds again.

--komatos/wasted
home.comcast.net/~komatos
Twitter: @KomatosRecords

On Jan 25, 2013, at 12:54 AM, Paul Maddox <yo at vacoloco.net> wrote:

> As Andy pointed out, it's all relative.
> the prophet 08 is around $2K, the 12 gets you 50% extra on voices and some extras for $3K.
> Again, the price is reasonable compared to his own stuff.
> and yeah, you can buy a monophonic voyager for $3K or a 12 note polysynth, I know where my money would go.
> 
> But this debate about pricing is why Tempest was killed, the world is so used to paying peanuts for synths. DSP synths have really crippled the market. Consider the inside of a DSP poly synth, maybe 3 or 4 large chips (couple of DSPs, MCU), some interface and power supply.
> The software will take a long to produce, so it has quite high development costs, but the cost to "replicate" that software is almost zero!
> Time to set up / test, again probably quite small, there's going to be very little in the way of presets that need setting up/adjusting.
> 
> Now, inside there hardware synth there must be 12 sets of oscillators, 12 sets of filters, 12 sets of VCAs, then you have the MCU, plus any effects, then the same interface logic and power supply.
> Development of the circuit is where a lot of the work is, a lot more than the DSP synth but there's still a hefty chunk of software in there.
> Now this is where the REAL cost is, the cost to replicate the hardware is far from zero, it's a minimum of 10 times the cost of the hardware for a DSP synth! but again the software replication is also minimum.
> time to setup / test, well test time no more than the DSP, but set up time could be considerable. Consider the DW8000, 8 VCF/VCAs, each had 6 presets to adjust and set up, just so the VCFs would track and everything would sound the same on each voice.
> 
> 
> Each voice board on Aurora is going to cost me around £100 in parts (I have 10 I want to build), then there s a control PCB (Budgeted around £80) and a panel (Budgeted on £500), so that's £1580 before I even start writing the software, or assembling it.
> 
> 
> like I say, DSP synths and scales of economy (like korg and ms20mini, I bet they do a run of 100,000 to start!) have made people forget just how much work, time and cost there is in building a true hardware synth for a small company like DSI (I think they're like 8 people?).
> 
> 
> "relative" is a good word, as is "realistic".
> 
> 
> Paul
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On 25 January 2013 02:51, Komatos <komatos at comcast.net> wrote:
>> I see your point, being a true analog synth with 12 note polyphony but it's still only duo phonic. That price is what similar analog synths like the Voyager, Andromeda, etc. cost because that is what the market is willing to bear.
>> 
>> My counterpoint: why is the market (read musicians, especially hobbyist musos who don't earn $$$ making music) so willing to bear that high a price? Does it really cost that much in component costs & labor to make? Or is it highly inflated?
>> 
>> --komatos/wasted
>> home.comcast.net/~komatos
>> Twitter: @KomatosRecords
>> 
>> 
>> On Jan 24, 2013, at 8:42 PM, Andrew Tarpinian <andrewtarpinian at gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> As in "analog synth with 12 voices..." street a little under 3. That's a pretty good price in comparison to the market, no? Everything is relative. A voyager is that price with one voice. 
>>> 
>>> I'm a freelancer and own my own business, most people would consider my day rate to be pretty high. But I don't always have work every day of the year and I live in one of the most expensive cities in the world and don't own a car. It's all relative. 
>>> 
>>> On Jan 24, 2013, at 8:17 PM, Tony Scharf <noisetheorem at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> I was gonna say....I do have a good paying job and that definitely isnt cheep!
>>>> 
>>>> On Jan 24, 2013 7:15 PM, "Komatos" <komatos at comcast.net> wrote:
>>>>> $3000 US MSRP is relatively cheap? Wow Andy. You must have a great paying job (or not much expenses) if you think that's cheap. I'm still paying off my $900 Beat Thang (of which I financed $425 & paid the other $475 + tax & SD cards in cash).
>>>>> 
>>>>> Please don't take offense with the above comment, but for that price you could buy a decent used car. I wish I could afford anything over $500 without financing for 6 months - a year.
>>>>> 
>>>>> --komatos/wasted
>>>>> home.comcast.net/~komatos
>>>>> Twitter: @KomatosRecords
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Jan 24, 2013, at 7:49 PM, Andrew Tarpinian <andrewtarpinian at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Jan 24, 2013, at 11:31 AM, Tony Scharf <noisetheorem at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I am going to own this one:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> http://www.davesmithinstruments.com/products/prophet12/index.php
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Ok I watched the video... now that's a synthesizer! I think though you really must wear a cape while playing it. 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> How the fuck is it so (relatively) cheap?
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